MMF2 and homebrew?

Hi all. I recently started learning MMF2 for the wealth of code that there is for it, but stopped upon realized that there is no way to translate the image to a ROM file- started learning 6502 assembly instead.
But an even better idea, I thought, would be to get into the homebrew scene and program through that outlet instead.
Big question, does anyone know if it would be possible to get a MMF2 game published or at least playable through anyone of the many engines that a homebrew system like the wii, for one example, supports.

If you aren't familiar look for the wiibrew wiki, if you have a wii and a sd card you are two tiny files away from unlocking your wii into a computer, with lot's of nice emulators and such.

Take mega man 9 for example. Lots of people love that game for it's NES qualities, but it wasn't designed on a NES or anything like a 6502.
I thought it might also be a sweet way for people here to play their games on an actual console if they haven't already. These games truly deserve it!

Thanks.

Well not sure that can be discussed here as homebrew involves hacking your console. And therefore, I don't see how you'd publish a game in that manner either.

Sorry to seem like a rebel, but this is the internet, and I'm just looking for information like everyone else. The internet police, will, not come for you.
Unless your moral compass deems that you truly must save the day by relinquishing information, and you'll feel better for that, just say it.

There are a couple of different runtimes for MMF2 that are in beta or coming soon (Java, mobile Java and Flash) in addition to the standard EXE variety - the EXE is pretty much tied in to Windows, but you may have some luck with the Java versions if the hardware that you're aiming for supports it (through unintended means or otherwise).

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Originally Posted by fireseed

Sorry to seem like a rebel, but this is the internet, and I'm just looking for information like everyone else. The internet police, will, not come for you.
Unless your moral compass deems that you truly must save the day by relinquishing information, and you'll feel better for that, just say it.

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Look, I'm not here condemning it, I'm just letting you know. I can't speak for Yves or Francois, but I'm pretty sure Clickteam would rather not have this sort of stuff on their forum. I'm not a mod however, so I'll let them decide.

In regards to publishing, how would you publish a game to be distributed, but require it to work on modified console? That wouldn't work at all.

Not trying to be rude, just being realistic.

No, theres no issues with Clickteam having it on their forum. Likely, it is prudent not to endorse such behavior, but there is nothing illegal or even unethical about homebrew hacking- it is clearly allotted for (at least in the USA laws) under fair use. It is also clearly against the best business interests of a company such as Nintendo, and they will be the ones to stifle it.

But yes as David says- an .exe compiled normally will only run on windows (or emulated environments like WINE but thats besides the point), but MMF2 offers support for exporting as Flash, Java, & mobile Java as well as a few others. And if these are supported by the wii (I have no idea), they would work. I know you can create browser games that could run "normally" on the wii via the internet, with no console hacking involved!

I'm pretty sure tat the wii doesn't support java, and the version of flash it has is much older than the one MMF2 will be able to export to.

I also know for a fact the Clickteam won't make a runtime for a homebrew system. There just isn't the money in it for them.

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Originally Posted by Pixelthief

No, theres no issues with Clickteam having it on their forum. Likely, it is prudent not to endorse such behavior, but there is nothing illegal or even unethical about homebrew hacking- it is clearly allotted for (at least in the USA laws) under fair use. It is also clearly against the best business interests of a company such as Nintendo, and they will be the ones to stifle it.

But yes as David says- an .exe compiled normally will only run on windows (or emulated environments like WINE but thats besides the point), but MMF2 offers support for exporting as Flash, Java, & mobile Java as well as a few others. And if these are supported by the wii (I have no idea), they would work. I know you can create browser games that could run "normally" on the wii via the internet, with no console hacking involved!

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Yeah I know it's not illegal to mod your consoles, but it's definitely against their end user license or terms of use or whatever. Microsoft will ban you from Xbox Live if you mod your 360 and it's detected. I was just speaking from my previous experience with various gaming forums. A lot of them won't allow discussions of homebrew or ROMs/emulators.

Cool, thanks for the intel.
I'll be publishing my stuff happy sometime.
Just look up wiibrew, like I said. You can publish, and it is quite the friendly community.
Cheers

Homebrew itself is not illegal. The reason many gaming communities ban discussion is because the steps to run homebrew are often very similar to those which allow for piracy, which is illegal.

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Originally Posted by Namida

Homebrew itself is not illegal. The reason many gaming communities ban discussion is because the steps to run homebrew are often very similar to those which allow for piracy, which is illegal.

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aye very good point. The two are often so interrelated it puts forum moderators in hot water when dealing with homebrew. However, for a community that is based around development of games and programs, rather than one based around playing them, it shouldn't be an issue

Of course homebrew is not illegal but I don't think there should be support for exporting to it. It's a matter of priorities and the huge amount of time it takes to do every export format, I'd be happier if Clickteam ditches a few of the export formats and display modes (Vitalize, Direct3D 8, DirectX) and focuses only on a few essential and commonly used ones (PC executable with software rendering, PC executable with Direct3D 9, Java, and Flash). To be realistic, few of us have homebrew flash carts for consoles, but the target audience is too small for this to be a priority.

Remember that all time spent is taken away from something else, which is why I'm often trying to push for remove and optimize, rather to add all these new features.

The legality of homebrew is irrelevant. There won't be a "homebrew" runtime for MMF2 because it would take a significant amount of time to develop, and few people would buy it.

Unless someone's volunteering to pay for its development?

I will pay LOTS of money for it to NOT be developed. ;)

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Originally Posted by LB

I will pay LOTS of money for it to NOT be developed. ;)

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I won't develop it!

I don't see the problem with it existing. I mean sure, I wouldn't use it, and I certianly am not going to push for one, but if they do make one, I see no reason to object to it. Certianly none to pay money to have it *not* made. >_>

There is no way CT would do this. Why would they? A mac version would be more important than this. Remember they are already working on HWA/Java/Flash/iphone/unicode/whatever else

So far this thread is pretty tame - I wouldn't mind reading information about how to get Java and/or a recent version of Flash to work on a Wii, but you won't see Clickteam do a homebrew Wii runtime as the market size (and legality) would certainly be some issues.

My hope is someday Nintendo allows Java and updates Flash on the internal web browser but I doubt this will happen. A regular wii exporter has the problem thats it could be pretty expensive with Nintendo's licensing and content quality expectations.

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Originally Posted by Namida

I don't see the problem with it existing. I mean sure, I wouldn't use it, and I certianly am not going to push for one, but if they do make one, I see no reason to object to it. Certianly none to pay money to have it *not* made. >_>

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What? You need to take time into the calculation. All time spent is 1: taken away from something else, and 2: needs even more time to keep updated as MMF2 is improved.

If time is spent on things that almost nobody needs, there'll be less time spent on the big important things.

Namida: You need to take time into the calculation. All time spent is 1: taken away from something else, and 2: needs even more time to keep updated as MMF2 is improved. If time is spent on things that almost nobody needs, there'll be less time spent on the big important things.

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Originally Posted by Jeff

So far this thread is pretty tame - I wouldn't mind reading information about how to get Java and/or a recent version of Flash to work on a Wii, but you won't see Clickteam do a homebrew Wii runtime as the market size (and legality) would certainly be some issues.

My hope is someday Nintendo allows Java and updates Flash on the internal web browser but I doubt this will happen. A regular wii exporter has the problem thats it could be pretty expensive with Nintendo's licensing and content quality expectations.

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Yeah one time I sent an email to the devs of Unity, and they said the Wii exporter was like 1 grand USD I believe.

It's easy to forget how inexpensive MMF2 is compared to a lot of similar tools - I also looked into that and was... fairly surprised by the price of its exporters!