hellos,
I know how to download your app did you get ....
Thank you.
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hellos,
I know how to download your app did you get ....
Thank you.
I have over 10 apps in the store that I have pushed in the past 4 months. My best apps have about 10,000 downloads every month. My worst apps have about 100 downloads a month. Keep in mind my apps are not breaking new ground like the other developers here since I committed myself for the first four months to producing commodity apps like Checkers and Blackjack in order to get the process of developing apps perfected. I will start pushing out original concepts and marketing in the coming weeks. I anticipate the results will be much more substantial.
Woah Keith, that's a big number, are of the highest paid download?
My first app "Color Machine" has had very few downloads, but is growing hope that the number of downloads increases, and I think I finished a promo video and make more noise in the apps forums.
10,000 wohaaaa...
Keith, what is the name of your app with downloads 10,000 and 100 ?
Guys they are free apps so I won't be retiring soon. Blackjack Smack has seen about 6,000 downloads this week and I released it in late November I believe. Poor little Checkers Electric which I labored the most on has a mere 500 downloads since release last Thursday.
Yesterday i sold 1 app and my two free apps had 2 downloads each. Iad revenue last 7 days $0.32. I made my paid app free for 2 days and received 700 downloads.
So far games are costing me at least 10x what they earn to make, not taking in to account my time but its early days and i hope one day i can make a game that is worth the time.
Keith i have played most of your games and never seen a single ad, do your free apps use iads ?
And Paid Apps?
Keith, how many downloads of your paids apps?
@Koji I only kept one app paid long enough to recover the investment cost of $600 USD which took less than three weeks. At it's peak as a free app it was doing about $40 a day in iAd. I've switched it back to paid for now to see how it performs. All my apps going forward have and will be free.
I believe the key to success is to create a portfolio of diversified apps that spreads out your risk and reward. You also need to time box your efforts. Spending dozens of hours creating an app is a substantial investment that I'm not willing to take. Example: I spent 15 hours creating Pyramid Solitaire Redux which is doing terrible, but I was able to reuse quite a bit of that effort to create Tri Peaks Solitaire Redux in less than 5 hours and it is doing about $250 a month in ad revenue after Apple's take. Over the course of 12 months it will teeter off I'm sure but I stand to get a net positive gain regardless even after factoring in costs such as licensing assets and software to build it.
All it takes is 1 app from a catalog of apps to be downloaded 150,000 times by US residents and played infrequently to see six digits of iAd in a year. It is really not an unrealistic goal and you stand a better chance to achieve it if you diversify your app portfolio. Creating many little apps creates other opportunities as well. By creating many little apps I can operate in the gaps created by mega studios. By making them free more people can use my apps and advertising allows me to still monetize them. I just had my 1,000,000th game played since my first app went live in early September. I'm getting 25-30k ad requests a day for ads and while only about 60% are from paid locations that is still an okay number 4 months in. Maybe when I start releasing high concept apps over the next few months I will look back and laugh at these numbers, but right now I'm happy considering the commodity nature and simplicity of the apps I've created. I could not put all my eggs in one app basket given the risk that creates, but by releasing an app a week as I plan to do this year I stand to really put out a portfolio where some apps fade to obscurity and others become brands I can embrace and build upon. Maybe then I can make them full-fledged apps and see the kind of downloads that would really enable substantial revenue.
I would like to add that marketing is a key element I am not doing, but that's because I believe that games will gain critical mass if they warrant it. Otherwise they will remain niche and still serve a purpose in realizing acceptable revenue.
To be fair I've been coding for 25 years (Java, C#, VB, etc.), using Photoshop since it came out with UMAX scanners in 1991, and have used many tools similar to MMF in the past (Director, Flash, Authorware, etc.) so I do have a leg up on delivering apps quickly. One thing that has been a pain is writing extensions in C++ and then Objective-C. If I had one wish for 2012 it would be the ability to do programming using LUA that would port to iOS. Games like Checkers with computer AI built on Minimax w/Alpha Pruning are really a pain to make happen in C++/Objective-C but fundamentally simple from a pure declarative programming standpoint.
Lastly, I look at the Clickteam community as a family so don't hesitate to PM me. We're all trying to do the same thing and each of us will have lessons learned that are invaluable.
I had some little succes with brutal Billy http://itunes.apple.com/nl/app/bruta...453997231?mt=8
and night terrors for the ipad, I put it up on itunes for 5 dollars or something and it get's downloaded 3/5 times a week.
Brutal Billy had over 800 downloads (079,) still getting 6 downloads a week.
Stumble Tumble doesn't do that well I have 23 downloads it's really a flop
Well, many thanks for your advice @ Keith and I think you're on the right track, I thought the same, make a catalog of apps that I perimiter an expectation as a developer in the App Store, I think we should have everything Apps payment and Apps Free Apps Free with iAds (the latter does not work well as income level) so we can build a catalog interesting. I also program for almost 30 years (I started at age 12 with a Sinclair ZX81) and I see this as a hobby that can be traced in a profession, I feel like in the 80's when the big studios did not exist and good Ideas worth gold. Please get the order, as I am for what you need.
Miballs has only had 112 downloads so far.
I was a little disappointed considering the amount of effort we put in on twitter, facebook and the fact that It was mentioned in a National newspaper. It has also had quite a few 5 star reviews.
It was a very simple game though. I do have an update in the works and what is coming will be much better.
Well done on your results Keith. Seems I may need to look into my strategy a bit...
@Keith thanks for the post. Very inspirational.
You've got a good plan and it looks to me you are executing and shipping.
I've always felt that everyone will have fantastic ideas from time-to-time and the biggest challenge is actually sitting down and creating. That is what separates many from the the possible successes of having a finished and shipped game.
Great thread!
If you game doesn't get featured your pretty much hopeless on the app store
15 hours a lot? You're definitely on a different plan from me =)
Not to say there's anything wrong with that. And not to say that me putting several months of work into my game will pay off. It's an experiment more than anything. I'm attempting some free marketing using facebook, youtube, and forums. And my hope is to attract a built in user-base of retro gamers.
But I have read articles about people who've put 6-12 months of full time work into their games, and then are disappointed that they're not making a full time income. I feel like being able to go from concept to product in 3 months is already a substantial advantage. Especially since I'm trying to create a game that would have cost $50 in the 80s.
So the two schools of thought seem to be many simple apps, or a single more full fledged experience. The latter I'm sure is the riskier play, and I'll find out the results soon.
Happily, typing clash force into google returns my game as the first two results. Typing 'clash force ipod' gives me the first 3 results. So it's a start. . .
@Jregork I think it is certainly worth it to create bigger apps if you can monetize them effectively. What I am doing is building libraries of apps that build off of the prior assets/structure so that over time I can build bigger apps in less time. Every app that I have done so far reuses either structural code and/or Extension code culled from prior versions. Although I am a developer I do not like raw development as it abstracts itself from creative synergy you get from composition-type development. I believe MMF2 is great because it can let you tap the power of raw code, but most of what you can do is achieved through real-time interactive design.
jregork is right, if you're not going to market it, you need to have a reason for people to buy your game. There are so many games out there, why would they buy yours and not others, unless they were catering to a particular niche?
The problem with marketing is that all these 69p apps, well, unless you get a snowballing viral phenomenon, most of the profit you make from a sale will have already been spent when that customer clicked your ad.
iInsultU (my non-MMF app coded entirely in Objective-C in Xcode) has had 892 downloads, Cow Boom has had 37, Hungry Beetle 19. Cow Boom was just for 'practise' so I wasn't really aiming to make any money from it, Hungry Beetle seems to have bombed though, which is a shame because it's a great game, however, no time or money was put into marketing it.
DistantJ why don't you release it free and use iAds..? you might more downloads if it's free.. seems a shame to make a game that only 19 people played!
So I will share what I consider to be some pretty useful and valuable things I have learned from creating iOS apps thus far:
1. What day of the week did you release your app?
I ask this because apps that are released on a Thursday tend to be exposed more as people become more active towards the weekends and kids download more games during that timeframe. If you put your app in the store on a Thursday it will show up in the top 75 in your category under Release Date more often than not and be visible throughout peak download times until mid-Sunday. Remember also that Thursday in the US is Friday in Asia so you ensure you get weekend exposure there as well; it's a quickly growing market as I can attest first-hand from working there for nearly 5 years recently.
2. How well did you categorize, keyword, and flesh out the details of your app?
This stuff really makes a difference. I'm not an SEO-fan by any stretch but make sure you keyword out your apps well or at least use phrases that will result in people looking for an app likes yours can find you. If you have a game about block puzzles called Blister Box then make sure you put things like puzzle, blocks, block puzzles, etc. etc. For tic tac toe electric I used all the international names for the game of Tic-Tac-Toe as keywords.
3. Have you ever considered the name of an app affects exposure?
What's the first thing you see when you go to a category for new apps on your iOS device by Release Date? It's usually the letter A (though a number and sometimes Chinese characters make it to the top). Naming your app Wolf versus Animal can really affect performance.
4. How often do you enhance features?
Releasing a v1.1 with new features not only makes your app better for users, but it also gets you back on the app store under "Release Date" as if your app was brand new. I have bought and tried just about every app on here and I will tell you that you are a very creative group. We all may just need a little bit more features here and there in order to take advantage of the exposure that being under "Release Date" brings.
5. Have you considered leveraging iAd?
My only paid app sold several hundred a day then teetered down to less than 5 after a few weeks. 5 a day seems nice, but I found that on iAd I could generate the equivalent of 57 a day. Upgrade to MMF2 Developer it's well worth it and iAd is a great way to monetize and spread your apps. My only paid app is used nearly 10,000 times a day and sees a solid 250 downloads a day week after week. I can make more on iAd and I allow more people to benefit from my app so it is win-win.
Nice tips Keith! But I think you'll find that point 4 is no longer true, updates don't put your game back on the first page by release date (but they used to!)
Good luck with your Game a Week plan
Keith has really changed my thinking process about all this, and restored my hopes for profit (both from iAds and from paid apps).
Thank you sir!
Hello @ keith I put the app for free for a week, and the results are wonderful downloads in two days nearly 2000 downloads. Now I think it is more profitable in these apps that are not AAA scheme using Apple iAds. :)
01/11
http://img833.imageshack.us/img833/2...lla201201t.jpg
01/12
http://img683.imageshack.us/img683/3...lla201201p.jpg
Yeah, nice work on the free download there, there's probably something to be said for releasing 'lite' versions with iAds alongside your paid full game. You just gotta be careful with Apple and demo versions, I learned that the hard way. They don't want anything which seems like a demo with disabled features, they want your 'lite' versions to be like small (but full) games...
Thanks DistantJ, do not you think best business apps with iAds that payment? Course is for those who are not our AAA.
Great work Koji! I would like to mention that every time I release my apps they do in fact appear under Release Date so point 4 has been valid for me thus far.
@ Keith Thanks for the advice, of course, you think I should include my app iAds with these levels of downloads?
Yes. Even if you were to only see a couple of dollars a day in iAd it would add up to something meaningful over the course of a year. What matters most are US downloads and the frequency they play the game. I see 10-20 USD a day on an app with only a couple of thousand US downloads because people are playing it often. Sometimes you can make up for play frequency on sheer downloads.
Excellent!!! :)
I'll update some things in the app and add the iAds in MMF, BTW, the space where the banner will be selected? thank you very much @Keith.
Another question, iAds is not only in the U.S. market, they also generate other countries right? or am I wrong and the U.S. is generating more traffic iAds?
They are "available" in several countries (France, UK, Germany, Japan) but ad buyers really only target US audiences. Apple lets people target their marketing.
Here's something to consider. Releasing your app as a paid version. Then later, after sales have fallen off (and if you don't have the money to spend on marketing) release a free version of the game with ads. Not a "lite version", but the full game, just with ads.
Does apple allow you to have two versions like this?
You can have a version with iads, and add a button to remove iads in your app (with in app purchase), i think it's a good solution !
Some comments to add to this, though Keith has done a fantastic job of giving you some information (apologies in advance for the long comments):
1. Don't think you will be successful on just one product... factor this in to your development plans/costs. I know a guy who made a game (3 years ago) and it sold 100,000, the game wasn't amazing but fitted a market that would buy...if he released it today, not sure if it would be as successful. I know others who have made a few apps at £5-20k which were of a lot higher quality and not made their money back. The market is unpredictable and its not clear cut what can be made a success and what not (look at the iTunes charts, who knows why some paid apps get at the top). Me personally, unless it was a game i had a lot of passion for and can afford to not get the investment back, i won't invest large amounts in it. So most of mine are lower investments, that way i can make more of them.
2. Know your market. Who are your key markets. Interesting to See Koji's downloads, that his were weighted in China. Obviously there is something he is doing (language options or product) that speaks to that market. My biggest downloaders are USA, UK and Canada, and those are the markets i will focus on, as they match my design/making requirements. USA is by far my biggest market. So i will in future make sure products are aimed at them, with the right product names. Because in the UK a road/path is called street, and in the USA its a sidewalk. So if i was thinking of releasing a game called Street, i would have to seriously think about Sidewalk.... Very important to remember that you may need to release two products in such as situation to cover both names so that both markets find it.
3. Timing is key, whether it is before an event or that countries national holiday. For example perhaps you are releasing a game for Valentines. First you need to get the product out before that date (but not too early to miss being near the top of the new releases) and secondly you need to take into account your key markets in (2) again.. is valentine a event in your key selected markets or is it a totally different day (I think Fathers/mothers day different dates in different countries). If an event has different dates, consider different named products with different release dates for those markets.
4. Portfolio: Creating one game and hoping or relying on it to be a success is not the way to get success. Creating good quality range of products will help you achieve better success in the longer run. As i've said some people have had success with one game, some 10, some 20..others i know didn't have it until they had done 200. It's a bit of luck, but if you enjoy doing this and you will certainly have different successes along the way which such keep you motivated until you move onto the next project.
5. iAds or full release. This is a difficult one.. if something earns you a lot of iAd's you could question if those same people would buy it and you would have made lots of money. No point worrying about what could have been. For me, I spend some money on making games, its not a massive amount (though i am going to be making some bigger games this year i hope).. for me my basic aim is to break even on those projects (though i can handle a loss so its not a big deal for me if a game doesn't do well). Knowing that.. i know that some will make a loss, some will break even, some may do ok, and hopefully one will hit the sweet spot and make a lot of money. But i am well aware that this may not happen overnight. But i know a lot of random people who have had success and they haven't done anything special.
6. Sales/downloads. People say you have to get featured to be successful or have lots of downloads. This is not true. Yes it helps a lot. But sometimes you might release at the right time with the right name, and you get lots of downloads. That is just the way it works :) this does match up with (3) though to some extent.
7. Updates Confusion. Ok there is some confusion in the past with this. Originally if you released a game and then updated it, it was considered a new release and went back to the top of the pile. THEN apple changed this. A lot of people still think this is the case, but in the categories section, product updates are put back at the top of the page...so YES updates are important to keep your product in the public eye in the relevant release date sections... don't believe me - go look at iTunes ;)
Anyway, i hope some of that helps and not confuses... i hope to release more information as and when i can as i learn how all this works in more detail.
Thanks Jason, you're the man!!
This is actually what I'm doing with Cow Boom. You don't need to release a second version though, just do an update which adds iAd support and then change the price tier to Free. I suppose you might worry about annoying those who have paid, but quite a lot of games eventually become free.Quote:
Originally Posted by jregork
This I think is a great choice and many apps are using this model. It's almost like a full demo if you love the game you want to remove the advertising. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by wesleyd
In this you have every reason @JasonDarby, one must know the market and target the most downloads. Nor do I wonder what they liked to the Chinese and Asians in general my game, will the graph. But applying the model to change my app "Color Machine" to a free app with iAds may not be such a good deal if I fall discharges in the U.S. and as I talked with @Keith is the market that actually generates money under this scheme .Quote:
Originally Posted by JasonDarby
A few things about the free app with paid upgrade versus just releasing a new version:
Pros:
-Your download numbers continue to add up for the original version.
-In a situation where the "free" app limits the app to a trial version, it allows the player to instantly upgrade while they're in the game.
Cons:
-I like up front costs. I don't like buying something I perceive as free, then finding out it's been gimped. Even if you explicitly state this in your description, people are going to miss it. They may feel like you're nickle-and-diming them.
-I'm always afraid of a bug that will allow them to use the full app without paying.
-In the case of a fully featured iad version, what are the chances that after playing with ads, they'll even be bothered by them? Most ads are not disruptive, appearing on level start screens, option screens, etc. By only having one version, that's free, you could miss out on potential sales from people who come across the paid app first. Or people who see a "free" version and a "paid" version in search, and assume the free version means "lite".
I also came across a discussion on the touch arcade forums about how the free download, pay to upgrade model wasn't working that well. You can see it here: http://forums.toucharcade.com/showthread.php?t=118730
My thoughts are this; Say in month one I get 2000 downloads, in month two I get 1000, in month three I get 500, month four I get 250. . . etc. 6 months in I'm not making much. The number of downloads is not making an impact on the app's visibility anymore, I have nothing to lose by releasing another app that cuts into the first app's downloads. I release a free iad supported version, and in month one I see a ton of downloads and start making some money off ads. Sales were down to nothing on the original version anyway, so I'm not losing any money, and the increased popularity of the iad version may turn into new sales for the paid version.
I think, really, it depends on the appeal of the game... It's not easy to repeat Angry Birds these days because everybody's trying to do it and unless you've got the kind of money the pros use on their marketing, it isn't going to get there. I think your game, jregork, has more appeal at face value - the screenshots, description etc. should be appealing enough to spend a few bucks on for most people, and if it's cheap enough I think people would even buy it out of curiosity, since it's a full-on game which will be in a 'new releases' list oversaturated with poor quality 'I wanna be the next Angry Birds' minigames.
I often look at the latest releases and download or buy a few myself, just to get into the mindset of 'what would make me go here and actually buy something I've never heard of?', and if it's not easy to convince me, it can't be easy to convince my customers. With any small-time app also, once the first couple of days are over, there's nowhere to find it after that unless you have some kind of marketing going on.
There's also a lot of stuff out there which is clearly amateur. Having programming skills doesn't mean a person has GOOD programming skills, or that they know how to design a game's aesthetics or gameplay properly, and people know this. You need to convince the layman with the visuals of your game that you're either some kind of game studio, or a true professional in terms of game design, otherwise your app just becomes another 'some dude made this in his bedroom and wants it to be the next Angry Birds'. People can detect amateur design.
What people DO seem to buy, which the market ISN'T oversaturated with, is medium to full length console-style games. Us MMF/tGF users have the advantage that these types of games are remarkably easy to create with some experience (though creating them for iOS does bring in new memory management challenges as jregork will be able to tell you) and a well-rounded console-style game offering a decent number of scrolling levels is never going to look cheap, or like somebody trying to copy Angry Birds.
I guess what I'm trying to say is, as startup developers, simplistic mini games will be much easier to move for free since people actually need a reason to spend their 69p ($0.99?) on your product over everybody else's, but the App Store is less saturated with full-on, console-style games and the few bucks businesses charge for them are still perceived as a bargain. This is my opinion anyway, and what I'm basing my current (almost done!) secret project on.
I agree with DistantJ, I'm going to try to cater to the 8 and 16-bit era fanboys (like myself).. carve out a niche, it's easy and fun to make retro style platformers/action games.
My plan so far seems to go along the lines of sell my game for a price (fairly low value) then after a month or so release an iAD version but as a seperate app, it will give users a choice to pay money for a more clean ad free version and not anger anyone who bought he game first, so many people seem to complain about spending 59p, and i'd like to keep people interested in my games as I go along.
Of course I still need to finish my first game heh.