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Thread: Firefly current progression

  1. #11
    Clicker Fusion 2.5 MacAndroid Export ModuleiOS Export Module
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    Due to he major success of fnaf and these comments, I plan on making a comparison chart for the who question the software in a low ball form (leavijg out a game here or a platform there) as well as a link to the interview clickteam did with Scott after fnaf 1. Everyone focus on the now and not the later which sets clickteam aside from AAA engines. Fees are now and none later where as everything is later or income dependent for unreal and unity.


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  2. #12
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    Kisguri's Avatar
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    Happygreenfrog I think our definition of 2.5D is completely different. I agree that Disaster at Firefly Station is over the top 3D in nature. But so are the other example games I have made myself. Dungeon Crawler and Neo Run Out have the level data generated from 2D initial coordinate information. But as in the instance of Neo Run out, I still have all three vectors of movement, things coming into you, the ability to move side to side, and the ability to use elevation to avoid objects. All rendered using 3D models in a 3D draw space. Seems fairly 3D to me.

    To me a example of 2.5D is as you had mentioned the platformer in the Firefly Examples MFA, as per the wikipedia defination that is certainly 2.5D

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2.5D

    Heck look at some of the stuff Patrice as been doing like...





    I myself am close to publishing my next tutorial, on how to make a Minecraft game.


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  3. #13
    Clicker Fusion 2.5 MacAndroid Export ModuleiOS Export Module
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    Here's some development footage of a game I'm working on in firefly. Granted, I've had minimal exposure to clickteam itself, I manage to figure this out




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  4. #14
    Clickteam Clickteam
    Kisguri's Avatar
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    Well done! Love the muted color palette!


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  5. #15
    Clicker Fusion 2.5 DeveloperSWF Export ModuleInstall Creator Pro
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    the problem was you didn't advertise the product correctly to the masses. Most bought this thinking it was a polished engine. I bought it immediately after you advertised it like this https://twitter.com/Clickteam/status...348224/photo/1

    Because I knew exactly what I was in for. People needed to be aware that this engine is REALLY early in development. On top of this you advertise the engine as being great for making FPS, RTS ect ect but the inbuilt systems aren't working properly. As such its not as easy as its made out to be because you're going to have to do most of that work yourself- as I have been doing.

    As for pricing, I had no issue with it, but that's because I do this for a living and could just write off the expense. I totally understand where people are coming from, but $100 for a game dev software package is pretty normal. The issue was more paying that much for a package that was so early in development.

    The biggest issue with the consumer is that they're comparing the engine to competing AAA engines.. when they should be comparing it to all attempts clickteam has done in the past at 3D. Firefly is by far the best one so far. I've used all of them. JaMagic, P3D, Raycaster and OpenGL. Firefly is better than those by a long mile. It works faster than those and the tri counts are massive. The implementation time for the engine is fast, you can get an art asset into engine, fully textured within seconds without any prep work.

    Is firefly a game creation kit. Not really. Is it a rendering package.. YEP. If you need 3D meshes displayed, and done fast with some limited dynamic lighting, then this is a great product.
    Clickteam is getting better and better with 3D all the time, and despite all the failures they still keep coming back. Firefly is exactly what I was hoping JaMagic was going to be.
    The problem at this point is that some of the objects we're reliant on to work the engine are buggy. I'm certain tri will eventually patch these out in time. And when it finally is, expect development speed to increase and you'll see the potential the engine has. The problem with the workflow is that it takes time, 3D art takes longer to produce than 2D which is why I've opted for a hybrid approach to speed things up.

    Lastly the main reason I bought firefly was because I needed something to do whilst I waited for Fusion 3 lol. Because of my work with Firefly I've discovered my new workflow that I'll use for Fusion 3 eventually.

  6. #16
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    Kisguri,
    Look, people were wondering why Firefly is not a success, I gave you, according to me, the reasons why.
    You know, when a customer give you some feedback about a failing product, it's useless to question the feedback itself and trying to explain how great your product is. It isn't. Or at least, it doesn't seem to be.

    I'm the kind of guy who has never hacked any software, because, as a developer, I respect the work of other developers. Paying has never been a problem for me, if the software worth it. I've been a customer of Clickteam for at least a decade. I've bought MMF 1.5, Jamagic 2d/3d, MMF2 , Fusion 2.5 Dev, the iOS exporter, and the Android Exporter.
    So you know what? Stop implying I don't wanna buy anything. That's disgraceful! I'm not greedy and insulting me the way you're doing is absolutely not the appropriate answer. It's very unpleasant and unprofessional.

    Before I give you 80 bucks for Firefly, I just wanna be able to see how your software is working. What can be done with it. How it is used. As I told you, EASINESS has always been the key to success of Clickteam's products. However, that doesn't SEEM -I may be wrong- to be currently the case. Period.

    You have to trial version. Period. That's not good, but this is not a deal-breaker. Period.

    The average users (including me) need examples, tutorials, videos, BEFORE we buy the product. What games have you done with this engine? How do you code? Can you show screenshots or videos on the way firefly works? I mean like CODING? There are just simple super short videos on youtube. And the games look just bad. And it doesn't show the code.
    Can you understand, people need to see your product before wanting to buy it? You have no trial version, fair enough! But at least, could you show tutorials or detailed examples of firefly before we buy it? Is it so difficult to get? Just make one mario 64 like level, and SHOW THE CODE. And please, for God's sake, no more choco freaking break tutorial. Real 3d please.

  7. #17
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    happygreenfrog's Avatar
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    The example you gave of something that someone easily made with Firefly was Chocobreak 3D (which is also 2.5D), hence the comment about 2.5D not being a good demonstration of how easy it is to use Firefly. I know that there are indeed plenty of decent 3D examples being made in Firefly, I'm just concerned that there isn't any evidence that it's anywhere near easy to make a proper 3D game, and all evidence points towards Platformers in particular being near-impossible, which is unfortunately one of the genres that would probably be easier for me to get working in 3D from a game design standpoint and thus one I'd rather use to get a feel for Firefly.

    Now, that being said, there is one game idea I've had that might be easy enough to make with Firefly, so maybe when I have the time, I can truly give it a whirl and give a better impression on it than simply mentioning that signs point to it being not as easy to use as, say, P3D.

    P.S. Looking forwards to the Minecraft tutorial... who knows? Maybe it'll give me an idea on how I can make a platformer in Firefly, seeing as how Minecraft had jumping and all that...

    P.P.S. I'm admittedly a bit biased towards P3D since I beta-tested it, but aside from the fact that it's software-rendered and therefore slow, I don't really get what's so bad about it. Honestly, I kind of want to see about maybe using the collision code and such from P3D and using it in a game rendered with Firefly to see if it can maybe make life easier in that regard, since the 3D collision detection in P3D is surprisingly solid.

    P.P.P.S. Take it from the guy who made a full game in P3D, I really want to see Firefly reach anywhere near its full potential, and I honestly want to try my hand at making a game in it already. But since I'm caught up in other projects, that combined with the fact that Firefly is clearly far from finished make it a lower priority than finishing a few of my existing games.

  8. #18
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    I can't post a image since my screenshots are png but based on the Android revenue alone of all 5 fnaf games here's what I came up with:
    Scott made a total of 5,382,000. Using clickteam he spent at most 1120(but release platform wise, 650).

    For unity he would have had to have the highest seat for 3 years at 125 a month. That equals 4,500 over the last 3 years.

    For unreal, he would have had to pay 5 percent on 448,500 four times a year. That's 24,425 four times a year for three years, totaling 293,100 over the past 3 years.

    There's two other platforms that the games was released on. Clickteam and unreal cost would remain the same. Unreal cost would drastically increase.

    Once again, clickteam isn't a AAA engine. Firefly was devleoped by three people. The project is under CI a and has drastically improved in the 5 months it has been out. Also, chocobreak from what I understand is basically trademark to fusion. That's like saying no Mario games on the new Nintendo console don't you think? And chocobreak was a "real 3d" game. As far as I remember, there are three axis. I agree documentation is spotty but now, video and tutorials are surfacing, me being one that are making them (Captain Quail on YouTube, shameless plug������). The team over the project have been listening and improved the engine based on out feedback. They have been interactive in the forums providing feedback and example mfa file downloads for specific problems.
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  9. #19
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    happygreenfrog's Avatar
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    The Chocobreak 3D tutorial moves purely on a 2D axis. If you're referring to something else, I'm all ears.

  10. #20
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    The gameplay yes but placement still has 3 axis.


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