[request] a potentially revolutionalr extension

[thps13]

And which is the priority? MMF4 in 2013 with almost easy for work with it?

The proposed HolyMonkey is absolutely brilliant idea. At first everything is nice with MMF2. Doing the demo and thinking.. this is very easy. Then you start programming more seriously and you realize that this is limited, and you need a lot work for create simple things or just you cant.

M.U.G.E.N. is absolutely incredible and I dont want heard stupid things about this program of any of the ways. With Fighter Factory i can create all my dreams with infinite posibilities and more that i dont know yet in very little time. And new version called Ultimate Fighter Factory incoming, is testing.

I totally agree with HolyMonkey. We dont think in evolution always? With work and effort could be added features of MUGEN(some of hundreds) to MMF doing a lot more powerful program; ++++ in less time. We want have fun programming and making pretty games in bit time. Like HolyMonkey post, the players will not to see if MMF have M.U.G.E.N in his engine, just want a good game.

MMF at this time is very limited, and this is the truth. Just think is without hardware aceleration, and other programs like this all have. What is limited... MMF or who are programming MMF? em,..ummh...

MMF. Make games without programming . JA, JA, JA .
Something really suk here....

[wizkidweb]

Yes, but having an engine built into an extension like this doesn't bring complete control over it. If you have the time or energy to develop a MUGEN-style engine in MMF, that would be amazing. But to simply take an engine already made, with code that is not usually understandable, and put it into MMF, it seems to defeat the purpose of MMF, which is to help people begin programming. Almost everyone I know who has used MMF is making games or applications in C++, and they all say that MMF helped them start this.

Now, don't get me wrong, MUGEN is a spectacular engine, but to implement it into MMF, it would defeat the purpose of developing games when you can make a whole game with 1 extension containing an engine and a couple of actions.

[Pkeod]

Commercial games don't need HWA. HolyMonkey, if you really know so much, then you also must know how to make money, and have money. So, pay someone to make the extension. thps13, you can make a game with MMF without traditional programming. If you want something less limiting, then what are you waiting for? Use C++, Java, or Python, and you will have much more freedom. MMF is limiting by its nature, but the side effect is that games can be made much more quickly than rolling your own game engine.

M.U.G.E.N. was written in C and the Allegro library. Why don't you learn those instead of wasting our time here? I don't understand why you are such a fanboy either. M.U.G.E.N. is for 2d fighting games, MMF can do so much more. The original developer is no more, and now only hacked version are made available.

Something really suk here? Probably you. Stop trolling this forum.

[BrashMonkey]

LOL. Whoaaaaahh.....thps13, I'm glad you see the potential in the features I'm suggesting but please let’s not stoop to badmouthing MMF2 and from using confrontational language. Also, there's already a very functional beta of MMF2 with HWA, so it’s only a matter of time before that’s a non-issue. And let’s not turn this into a MUGEN VS MMF fan-boy thread.

Wizkidweb, I agree with you 100 percent. That’s what I was trying to say all along. Ideally it would allow for access to the variables, animations and such (both retrieving and changing.) Ideally, the users (US) could use and or access only as much as we want... either just animation and collision data, or variables as well, or even the entire engine with AI, controls and gravity included.

Pkeod, "Commercial games don't need HWA" is along the same line of thinking as "good games don't need more than 2 buttons" or "People don’t need games" . I assume you make only 2 color games with no sound and 1 button support?
Also, why turn this into personal challenges? Having experience in the mobile industry and having used some of the best dev tools in that industry does not in any way make me a money mogul, and aren’t people that are smart at making money even smarter at keeping the money they make! Also I seem to recall pledging 300 dollars toward this goal…I was hoping others would do the same.

Thps13, if you like the idea so much, will you also pledge some hard earned dough to help entice a real programmer to make it happen? This would have gotten much better results than badmouthing MMF.

It's frustrating to me that throughout this thread there's way more text spent on philosophical and personal debate than over the actual features I'm suggesting end up in MMF2. In that regard, what little text is devoted to those features agree with me completely or at worst suggest it would make making games “too easy”. Let me just reiterate on that point: An electric typewriter does NOT write an award winning novel, it just allows a creative mind to create with less wasted time and energy. Sure there will be the majority of people who will use “easy” tools to make generic crap…but that’s already being done with MUGEN, MMF, FLASH, and every other authoring tool, no?

Anyone who’s disinterested in these features, why bother posting, post and pledge in threads suggesting features you’re actually interested in using? Anyone who IS interested, please voice your interest or better yet, make a pledge or provide useful information.

I know from first-hand experience that placing and tweaking multiple collision boxes, spawning points, and variables with ease in a GUI, right on the character frames is WONDERFUL for workflow and allows for creating better games drastically faster. I don’t need to prove I’m right. I’m not looking for arguments. I’m exploring EVERY resource I have (not just this thread) to make this a reality for the benefit of all of us, including Clickteam. I’ve never made a single game or character in MUGEN, I personally don’t need the sideways-compatibility EXCEPT for the fact that it would allow for the use of pre-existing tools that are robust and supported (NOT ABANDONED), and that it would draw new users and customers to Clickteam.

[Pkeod]

HolyMonkey, I'll say it again: HWA is not needed for commercial games. It will be a better idea not to use HWA even when it's available, because even after many years so many people's computers still don't have basic shader support.

There are already so many feature suggestions for MMF, and in all honestly we're not likely to get what we want. One thing I've been asking for a long time is a better way of displaying text, a modern version of text blitter with alpha support, but I don't see it happening. I can use Python along with the PyGame modules and get pixel fonts with alpha support displayed within minutes. So, if you want this don't wait for it to happen: get coding and make it happen.

[BrashMonkey]

Pkeod, I see no need to argue over your opinion about the right way (your way) of making games. We are making games here, not saving lives. there is no "NEED", only wants) Many peope WANT to make HWA games. Many other want to play and purchase HWA games, maybe just to look at all the pretty effects.

I'm sorry we havent gotten a better pixel font extension, I'd like that too, but maybe the fact that it can be handled within minutes with Python as you stated is the big distinction between your request and this request. Can you reproduce all or most of the features I'm suggestion within minutes with currently existing extensions?

We all have priorites and strength and weaknesses. No need to suggest I code it myself or pay others yet again, we've all heard you before... As you hopefully remember, I'm offering to pay others (beyond this thread even) and As I said before, I'm an artist, NOT a programmer. My family, day job (to support said family) and my several side-projects already in the works consume all of my availible time. Coding this feature-set is far beyond my availible time and people with strengths I lack could do it mucg better and much faster.

I challenge myself to learn new things all the time, but right now this can't be one of those challenges... and others shouldn't have to wait for me to figure it out. By then we'd be at MMF 6 I'd wager

PS. I'm sure tons of people could benifit from your pixel font solution. Have you posted an example?

In my humble opinion, people should spend more time making sure they're right, and less time trying to "prove" it.

PS, unrelated topic: Fairie Solitaire is looking awesome. I have every respect for your abilities and point of view, there's just no need to compare either with anyone else in this thread. At least, thats not why I made the thread in the first place.

[Bornemix]

HolyMonkey, I'll say it again: HWA is not needed for commercial games.

Let's put it this way: HWA is not needed for [color:#b00000]all[/color] commercial games.

That wording is more just, reasonable and polite (and less provocative).

:grin:

[Pkeod]

I'm an artist, NOT a programmer. My family, day job (to support said family) and my several side-projects already in the works consume all of my availible time. Coding this feature-set is far beyond my availible time and people with strengths I lack could do it mucg better and much faster.

I challenge myself to learn new things all the time, but right now this can't be one of those challenges... and others shouldn't have to wait for me to figure it out. By then we'd be at MMF 6 I'd wager

When I was going to college I used to say this too. Now I can code in many languages as well as do decent art because success in learning (and everything else) favors perseverance.

PS. I'm sure tons of people could benifit from your pixel font solution. Have you posted an example?

Python/Pygame has nothing to do with MMF. I was just about to jump ship and quit using MMF altogether, but then 249 came around and with it there is the possibility of being able to compile to Mac very easily. As soon as this is finalized and there is better support for sound and saving player data, my loyalty will once again be cemented. MMF is already an amazing tool, and it can be used to make extremely sell-able games quickly. Would you believe it that many developers who have made games that take advantage of the hardware didn't make much money? Instead they moved to making games with simple graphics in comparison and were able to make 10x more. This is why I say commercial games don't need hwa, because if you're going to sell your game you don't want to limit the number of people who can play the game at all. You can if you want, but it's a stupid choice imo.

Pixel fonts with alpha is just something I want (think how counter objects support importing images with alpha blending for every number, then have a string object that allowed you to do the same thing... you wouldn't be able to change the font size, but at least text would look consistently better than relying on the renderings produced by the string object alone), until then I just render all of the in game text into active object. It means the file size is a bit bigger, but I'm still able to get a good result.

[Bornemix]

A PyGame extension, perhaps?

[Pkeod]

Lolz, no. :P http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pygame