just after a quick answer on the 3D mesh.

[Gibbon]

the 3D mesh seems just the object for what i need. only one simple object, with one texture and doesnt need to be a amazing model.

The problem im having is. The object is needed to like, roll and pitch like an aeroplane say. And ive noticed that... rotating the object via the X (so pointing the object up or down) stays relevent (correct) no matter what the other angles move it to, Likewise with the Y but the Z (roll in this case) isnt. If you rotate the objects X and then rotate the Z it just rotates the object as it was.

Hard to explain really. If you feel like helping me out, the easist thing to do is simply open ur MMF add the mesh obj, load a model, and set the X rotation to you up and down keys, and the Z rotation to your left and right keys and you will understand then.

It might just be how it is, and its me getting it wrong. Just seems that the an object can pitch up and down what ever angle its at, yet it cannot roll correctly.

Thanks
Andy

[Gibbon]

Erm.. i belive from reading, this is common problem and named Gimbal Lock http://www.anticz.com/eularqua.htm

Anybody know the math or where i could find the math, to overcome this?

Basically, im wanting to have my object roll, pitch and yaw.

Thanks
Andy

[geothefaust]

That's right, it's call gimbal lock! Unfortunately for everyone, there is no such math to overcome this with an Euler based rotation.

Quaternion could, but that would require the 3D mesh object to also have support for Quaternion rotations, but alas it does not. (that I'm aware of)

As I haven't used the object, I can't say for certain. But when I do any kind of rigging for anything in 3D, I always setup a couple of different things to help alleviate the gimbal lock problem.

I do think one of these things could help and almost be directly applicable to what you're trying to do. I would make an invisible object that you will then use as a target for your ship (or whatever it is you're trying to control). Then, all you need to do is worry about the bank rotations (or roll).

Too bad there is no way to have a parenting scheme like in 3D applications to alleviate the problem, in MMF2.

[Gibbon]

Hmm thats a shame. So using to clarify ,using 3D mesh there is no way of simulating roll, pitch & yaw correctly?

Is there another object that can load just a single model and can do roll, pitch and yaw?

Im not making a 3D game, i know mmf is designed for 3D. Im making a educational program, and just need a 3d model to being to roll pitch ETC. No movement or anything. Just roll pitch and yaw via arrow keys.

And to understand your advice, do you mean have to of the same object? One visble with roll, and the other invisble with say pitch and the visible object gets the pitch values from the invisble object? Or am i totally wrong? lol.


Thanks
Andy

[Gibbon]

Does anyone know if this is possible at all? Any maths to make convert the XYZ rotations into roll, pitch, yaw?

Cheers
Andy

[geothefaust]

That *might* work, that is to say; Using another object as reference for one of the rotational axes. *IF* this is possible in MMF, then you'd want to use the heading and pitch (yaw and pitch) of your original item, with another item for the bank (roll). You'll get tighter control. Even better still is to use an object for each axis.

For the targeting idea, the way targeting works in MMF would dictate if it works or not. I haven't tried, but I'm assuming that targeting in MMF (like any other program) works with two axes, or it wouldn't be targeting. That said the two axes should be heading and pitch (yaw and pitch). So if you did target an item, you would then control bank with your original item, and the other two with your targeted item.

Then to follow up your other question:

Does anyone know if this is possible at all? Any maths to make convert the XYZ rotations into roll, pitch, yaw?

It's quite impossible without Quaternion rotations.

[uprize]

There is an object called 3D Actives. I havnt used this before So I have no idea if it will work for what you want to do, but may be worth checking it out. Its an extension that can be downloaded from neatwares extension list over there----------->